Pioneer PDP-LX608D - NOT using ISFccc Option

[pppp1]

Still haven't used controlcal, i need a usb-serial adapter, tried a few shops today and i didn't find one :mad:, i guess i'll need to buy one online :(. However i had a go at calibrating the tv's movie mode using colorhcfr, the eyeone sensor and the avshd709 avchd disk. I used getgray ntsc to set contrast and brightness as well. Here are the results. I'm looking for advice for further improvement. As it is i don't like dEs for green and blue and gamma tracking is not flat. i find it very hard to get blue with a low dE.
Any advice will be greatly appreciated.


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[pppp1]

Measurements

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[D-Nice]

Can you post your actual LX608D settings? Are you targeting SMPTE-C or Rec709 for color as the red and blue points are inside the triangle?

[pppp1]

I selected the HDTV-REC709 from the colorhcfr menu as i was using the avshd709 disc. Sorry i forgot my settings. Here they are:

Picture mode: MOVIE
Contrast 38
Brightness +2
Colour +11
Tint 9 Red
Sharpness -15

Pure Cinema
Film mode (Off for calibration but use Standard and Advanced as well depending on material, does it make a difference?)
Text Optimisaton Off

Intelligent Mode Off

Picture detail
DRE Picture Off
Black Level Off
ACL Off
Enhancer Mode 2
Gamma 2

Colour Detail
Color Temperature Manual
RH -2
GH 0
BH +3
RL -4
GL +1
BL -1

CTI Off

Color Management
R -2
Y +4
G -4
C +6
B +6
M -3

Colour Space 2

Noise Reduction
All Off

Others
3DYC 2
IP 2

Drive Mode 1

[D-Nice]

Ok, things are starting to make sense now. Did you adjust the color points with the CMS controls first or did grayscale come first?

[pppp1]

Ah basically i set brightness, contrast, color and tint and then was going back and forth color management controls and color temperature controls with a few small changes in color and tint. Is there a process that should be followed? I read the forums, the dummie guide to calibration tutorial and tom huffman's guide but i always find myself adjusting rgb high and low for greyscale and color managment controls together as they affect each other.

Any advice? especially for gamma?

When i display the separate rgb lines on the gamma curve they are all over the place. Should they all be flat around 2.2? Or is it expected that the 3 colors will behave differently and just the average will be at 2.2?

Can you please comment on the current results please.

[D-Nice]

Ah basically i set brightness, contrast, color and tint and then was going back and forth color management controls and color temperature controls with a few small changes in color and tint. Is there a process that should be followed? I read the forums, the dummie guide to calibration tutorial and tom huffman's guide but i always find myself adjusting rgb high and low for greyscale and color managment controls together as they affect each other.

Any advice?Here is my work flow for a 8G Kuro with the regular A/V selections:


Set peak luminance (Contrast)
Set black level (Brightness)
Correct grayscale (RGB High/Low)
Correct color points (CMS controls)
Tweak grayscale (RGB High/Low)
Verify grayscale and color points again
Set color saturation (Color)

especially for gamma?

When i display the separate rgb lines on the gamma curve they are all over the place. Should they all be flat around 2.2? Or is it expected that the 3 colors will behave differently and just the average will be at 2.2?

Can you please comment on the current results please.Since you are not using the ISFccc profile, you should only be using gamma 1 or 2 for your particular A/V mode. To get a better gamma curve, reduce your contrast setting. Dropping your brightness to +1 should also help.

[pppp1]

Here is my work flow for a 8G Kuro with the regular A/V selections:


Set peak luminance (Contrast)
Set black level (Brightness)
Correct grayscale (RGB High/Low)
Correct color points (CMS controls)
Tweak grayscale (RGB High/Low)
Verify grayscale and color points again
Set color saturation (Color)

Since you are not using the ISFccc profile, you should only be using gamma 1 or 2 for your particular A/V mode. To get a better gamma curve, reduce your contrast setting. Dropping your brightness to +1 should also help.

I don't understand how cms works really. If a primary color is inside the triangle how will pushing it towards either of the two secondary colors next to it help? And don't you have to do color saturation before cms? before doing color satuaration the triangle is well undersaturated at -6 of movie mode with color space 2.

[pppp1]

Calibration file attached

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[Wolfy]

I don't understand how cms works really. If a primary color is inside the triangle how will pushing it towards either of the two secondary colors next to it help? And don't you have to do color saturation before cms? before doing color satuaration the triangle is well undersaturated at -6 of movie mode with color space 2.Pioneer TVs as of yet does not have a CMS (Color Management System). What Pioneer calls Color Management is really only an advanced Tint control, i.e. you can rotate the primaries and secondaries slightly, but that's it. In any case, I would be very conservative in using the Pioneer Color Management, i.e. only for a small adjustment and always double checking the grayscale tracking.

My work flow for the European 8G Pioneer is, if you even want to use the Pioneer Color Management:

Black Level (Brightness)
White Level (Contrast)
Check primary Gamut (rotate primaries with CM if necessary, but very conservatively, check grayscale, if grayscale starts to change from tracking flatly change the CM setting back to where grayscale tracks flatly)
Adjust Grayscale (RGB High/Low) together with Gamma with 9-point controls (conservatively)
Check Gamut (rotate secondaries (and primaries if they moved) with CM if necessary - conservatively, if negative impact on grayscale, leave as is)
Adjust color decoder (Color)
Re-check everything from the start, if OK you're done!