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Old 10-05-2008, 01:58 PM   #1
Turbe
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Default Understanding the Pioneer 9G ISFccc Interface

Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
The ISFccc modes on the 9G Elites will arguably produce the most pleasing picture post calibration....if they are setup properly. None of the other modes on the 9G Elites will compare... even if 2D measurements say they are equal. Its built into their templates and to understand why, one would need to start paying attention to 3D measurements
Quote:
Originally Posted by mt14942
I understand that once I have my 151 calibrated with the ISF a/v modes that I cannot change them w/o controlCal; but will I still be able to access them form my remote control like I would any of the other a/v modes. Another words will I be able to switch to optimum or movie and than switch back to ISF day or ISF night? Sorry if this seems to be a stupid question.
Thanks,
mike
Quote:
Originally Posted by mt14942
The way I see it just having these 3 additional a/v mode options which can be individually calibrated for all of your inputs (Blu-ray, Satellite, etc.) makes it worth while. So I would be content if it would be just as good as a calibration using the Pure user a/v mode. You would still have all these other a/v modes (optimum, performance, etc.) to choose from for added vibrancy when watching sports or whatever. If by chance you do get more detail, more depth and better colors with more punch than all the better. Seems like a best of both world's scenario. Just my opinion.
Mike
Quote:
Originally Posted by luvnhateSony
This ones easy, YES. The ISF modes will just simply be added to your selection of existing A/V modes so you can switch it up as easily as you do now.
"So I would be content if it would be just as good as a calibration using the Pure user a/v mode. You would still have all these other a/v modes (optimum, performance, etc.) to choose from for added vibrancy when watching sports or whatever."

I've always said the main benefit is that fact that you add additional memories Per Input (the Per Input is key).

Understanding the Pioneer ISFccc Interface:

http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...1#post14462861
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...5#post14440655
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...3#post14440343
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=5575
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post14750559

ISFccc vs Pure Info and Reports:

Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
That is correct. Specifically the gamma controls. ISFccc on the Elites are the only modes that allow you to have either a 2.0,2.1,2.2,2.3,2.4, or 2.5 ruler flat gamma curve. You cannot do that in any other mode on the Elites.

You also cannot go beyond 41fL of peak light output on any other A/V and retail a ruler flat grayscale and gamma.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...2#post14691872







Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
  • The ability to go beyond 41fL of peak brightness without clipping whites or destroying gamma.
  • Much more felxibilty with the gamma
  • Better low end grayscale
  • Greater picture depth because of the above
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...9#post14695249


Quote:
Originally Posted by PARASITE
Does mean above 40ftl on a 151? If that is the case I will eat crow!
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooper750
You can achieve above 40 ft lamberts on a 151 without clipping or discoloration. Got 42 ftl to be exact. Here's a link to grayscale and gamma / luminance charts for a 151FD I just did yesterday. This is ISF Day mode readings.

Pioneer PRO-151FD ISFccc Day
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=5609

Quote:
Originally Posted by JazzGuyy
Under what circumstances would you need that much brightness?
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooper750
In a well lit room.
Plus consider that you should be shooting for maximum dynamic range as long as there is no clipping, discoloration (color shift) and eye fatigue.
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
How far could you push the contrast setting in one of the ISF modes before you saw clipping or discoloration?
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooper750
For the ambient lighting of the room during the day, the 42 ftl worked out great. Never did push the set to the limit of clipping so can't be sure how far beyond 42 ftl I could have gone. I hit 42ftl and for the given environment figured that was enough. I do wish I had one of these on hand so I could play and evaluate it some more. I do have to say though that once calibrated the set looked awesome. I was very happy with the results.
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
So far, I've seen 53 fL without any major issues with the grayscale or discoloration.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PARASITE
Jeff is going to be doing a few before he gets to me. If he can verify the improvements of isfccc, especially the ability to go higher then 30ftl, then its a no brainer I will go with isfccc, one for day and one for night.
Quote:
Originally Posted by scooper750
Myself & D-Nice have already showed the 151FD will exceed 30 ftl in ISFccc mode. But feel free to get confirmation.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PARASITE
Would running a 151 at 42ftl increase the possibility of image retention?
Quote:
Originally Posted by D-Nice
No.
Quote:
Originally Posted by turbe
I just got off the phone with Kevin Miller... he did his first 9G Elite using the ISFccc Interface (and ControlCAL ) today.

Model was the PRO-151FD

for ISF Night: 35 fL
for ISF Day: 51 fL with no clipping or other issues

I am allowed to quote him (he will eventually post on his Blog):
He now sees this added dynamic range as one of the benefits for the 9G's ISFccc Interface.

He did find that the Pioneer BDF-05FD BR Player was clipping White (out of the box), he had to turn down Contrast one click (source problem).


Add one of the "Big Guns" who see the benefit of the 9G ISFccc Interface over Pure.

http://www.imagingscience.com/personnel.htm
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showt...4#post14703894
Quote:
Originally Posted by DTV TiVo Dealer
Correct, this is one of my VIP customers who also called me to say how terrific his panel looks after Kevin Miller's ISFccc Interface over Pure calibration. Pioneer, Miller, ISFccc Interface over Pure ControlCAL software and ValueElectronics make a unbeatable combination.

Our industry has has leap frogged like a bull frog on steroids and we're all in for the ride.

-Robert
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=5676

Quote:
Originally Posted by luvnhateSony
The ISF modes over Pure gave me a punchier picture, added detail, added depth, added shadow detail, perfect colors and a big ol' to top it off. It's essentially Pure mode on steriods if you will. Anyway I really cant say enough about it and I cant say enough about the great D-Nice.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=5336

Quote:
Originally Posted by darita
Just had my 151 calibrated in ISFccc modes by David Abrams. Great guy. I had previously had the set calibrated in Pure mode. Once David was done, I could immediately see the difference. In a direct comparison, ISFNight has the pop that I was hoping to see. I guess the 45 ftL in ISF mode helps achieve that. To my untrained eye, I can see a difference in contrast, detail and brightness. The blacks are blacker without losing detail and the whites are whiter without clipping. The picture looks crisper, but not unnatural. To me, Pure mode had a washed out look. So far, I'm happy with what I see. Now all I have to do is find the time to sit down and really watch this thing.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=6087

Quote:
Originally Posted by mt14942 View Post
My overall impression is that the calibrated ISF Day with the brightness level set at 37fl did result in more accurate coloring and more visible detail especially when looking at facial tones. There was also more vibrancy or pop to the over all picture. I would not say it was dramatic but noticeably a little brighter when compared to the Pure mode; I would say about a third of the way between Pure & Performance mode.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=6967

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ken Ross
I've just begun using this great software and as D-Nice has said in the past, once you go ISFccc mode, you'll never go back to Pure mode.

Pure almost looks drab by comparison and it reminds me of what plasma fans have so often heard from some on this forum...plasmas have dirty whites. Although I don't agree, anyone that feels that way should take a look at ControlCal and what the ISFccc mode has to offer. If you want brighter whites than this, you better grab your sunglasses.

At the same settings as Pure mode, the ISFccc mode is significantly 'punchier', yet I can see no crushing of whites or blacks when using it...at least visually.

But I think you really need to be careful using this mode if you don't have sufficient hours on your panel. The fact that the panel is driven harder makes the issue of break-in that much more important.

As I said, I just began using ControlCal and am only just beginning to explore it's features. A big thanks to Turbe for some lame issues I had at the beginning. It's amazing how much you learn if you actually READ the instructions!

BTW, I am using a USB>Serial adapter.
http://www.avsforum.com/avs-vb/showp...postcount=1575

Quote:
Originally Posted by PARASITE
Cant wait, 42ftl here I come. Thanks D-nice and Turbe for showing me the light.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PARASITE
Jeff came and calibrated my 151 yesterday

~

Long story short, you can count me on the users who prefer isf over pure.

How to view the ISFccc Information

NOTE: Your Calibrator can customize this information


AV Selection showing isf Day

Last edited by Turbe; 05-30-2009 at 01:12 PM.
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